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    Posted: 26 Aug 2010 at 1:36pm
Why is it that we're apparently more afraid of Iraq, Afghanistan, Iran, and North Korea, when only North Korea might be the only one capable of striking us, if they even can?  Sure, there is the threat that terrorists might acquire a suitcase nuke from Iran, but still.  Mexico is in our own backyard and yet all we care about it "securing the border," never mind actually helping them with the out of control areas.  I'm not saying I'm not afraid of Iran and North Korea, just that I'd be more afraid for Mexico and maybe even Venezuela right now.  They're a lot closer to home than the "Axis of Evil" countries.
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the border needs to be secured asap, border security is seprate from imigration. we need to help Mexico as much as possible, its kaotic over there.

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Posts: 2994 		Post Options Post Options   Quote TuNA FISh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Aug 2010 at 11:51am
heard on NPR that 72 people were found murdered in mexico near the texas border.... that's f***ing crazy.. they say all the people were killed around the same time too.. 
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Posts: 2994 		Post Options Post Options   Quote TuNA FISh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Aug 2010 at 7:01pm
Originally posted by Heavenly_tRiNiTy

Originally posted by SP61gTSupra

Originally posted by TuNA FISh

Originally posted by Heavenly_tRiNiTy

Originally posted by SP61gTSupra

Originally posted by Heavenly_tRiNiTy


Do people think someone just invented the idea of a creator God or is it actually possible that through naturally observed phenomena man came to the conclusion that everything is created and nurtured.
''If God didn't exist, man would have created him'' -Voltaire
nice quote but Voltaire would state that, he was opposed to the old establishment, those powers of the divine and nobility. Its his opinion as a philosopher and i realise he said "IF" but he's kinda suggesting that we need a father figure whether real or make believe. France were the first modern secular nation if i recall correctly. Roots of modern atheism?
Stephen Hawkins suggested that if we recognise that the universe has a beginning then it is possible for the universe to have a creator. The big bang theory ( the beginning of universe) doesn't mean there is no god. The universe is measured by space/time but what happened before time (prior to the big bang) is immaterial because it has no observed/measurable/significant impact. Then again he also said that the universe is ever expanding so it has no beginning nor end which challenges the place of God in the universe.
For me, once religion placed itself in direct opposition of science, there was a shift in power. Religious philosophers were proved profoundly wrong on fundamentals as the orbit of the earth/sun and its position in the universe. They obviously mistrusted or felt threatened by scientific enquiry. So once science proved to be more accurate than religion it questioned many others things such as our origin etc. Religion got it wrong and science is seemed more reliable the faith. But religion is flawed because man puts himself in charge of God's affairs and man is imperfect. If god approves in your actions then you are justified by the highest power and no man can question an authority greater than ours right? The creator made no requests that we worship him in church/temple every week or that we nominate a leader on his behalf or that heaven has a limited amount of places afaik. But you can find justification for this in the holy books - Bible/Koran/Torah. Thats where imo the corruption lies, individual faith can be a purer form of belief. Is it possible for a universe to be created? for me, yes because as we observe everything is created/born. 
And i agree with you when you said if god exists he would be nothing like we imagined. If you accept that he made us in his own image then it doesnt mean we have the same appearance.
And TUNA I didnt know Paw was trying to prove there was a god, he could have given better examples than that one though lol. 

lol actually stephen hawking compared the question "what's before the big bang" to "what's beyond the north pole"
I remember him saying to a question of what happen before the big bang.  "What happen before the big bang, doesn't matter."
yea i think its his attempt to explain to us what is inexplicable or infinite because infinity just is. I dont know about the north pole analogy but beyond the north pole is the south pole so he might b suggesting that space curves in hence wormholes and time travel. Or maybe hes just stating its nothing significant idk.
I can't remember where i read this but i recall scientists trying to discover the theory of everything where all laws are known and the secrets/origins of the universe are revealed - no more unanswered questions. Is there such a thing? Once we do or if we achieve this then we would theoretically know as much as God or be gods, take your pick.

green: i don't think he was saying space is curved but who knows! i thought he was making fun of the question.. i didn't think he was being literal
red: it's called the string theory!
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Posts: 2994 		Post Options Post Options   Quote TuNA FISh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Aug 2010 at 6:56pm
Originally posted by uc SYZYGY uc

Stephen Hawking has been doing nothing but thinking for years! His life story is one of pure mental toughness. if he doesn't inspire you nothing will! BUT he doesn't have the answers! Probability=Odds are or Most likely

Thats the best even he can do! and he's given it more thought then most anyone! he leans towards Intelligent design though? HM

IMO there's more! how could there be more though if man can't see it or find it? maybe it doesn't dwell here? maybe it only visits and doesn't stay? maybe we will all find out soon?

1 thing is 4 sure! were at a very bad time! Kaos is beginning to rare its ugly head! the *Iran having nukes* issue is without a doubt the most dangerous situation in our history! they all haft to get that one right!

If Iran's leadership is serious about wiping Isreal off the map? then that puts the rest of the world in a very troubling possition!

what should be done though? thats may be the most important question in our history? i just hope there smart enough to answer it!

that is the first time i have ever heard that and i'm sure it isn't true
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Posts: 2101 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Heavenly_tRiNiTy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Aug 2010 at 8:20pm
Originally posted by SP61gTSupra

Originally posted by TuNA FISh

Originally posted by Heavenly_tRiNiTy

Originally posted by SP61gTSupra

Originally posted by Heavenly_tRiNiTy


Do people think someone just invented the idea of a creator God or is it actually possible that through naturally observed phenomena man came to the conclusion that everything is created and nurtured.
''If God didn't exist, man would have created him'' -Voltaire
nice quote but Voltaire would state that, he was opposed to the old establishment, those powers of the divine and nobility. Its his opinion as a philosopher and i realise he said "IF" but he's kinda suggesting that we need a father figure whether real or make believe. France were the first modern secular nation if i recall correctly. Roots of modern atheism?
Stephen Hawkins suggested that if we recognise that the universe has a beginning then it is possible for the universe to have a creator. The big bang theory ( the beginning of universe) doesn't mean there is no god. The universe is measured by space/time but what happened before time (prior to the big bang) is immaterial because it has no observed/measurable/significant impact. Then again he also said that the universe is ever expanding so it has no beginning nor end which challenges the place of God in the universe.
For me, once religion placed itself in direct opposition of science, there was a shift in power. Religious philosophers were proved profoundly wrong on fundamentals as the orbit of the earth/sun and its position in the universe. They obviously mistrusted or felt threatened by scientific enquiry. So once science proved to be more accurate than religion it questioned many others things such as our origin etc. Religion got it wrong and science is seemed more reliable the faith. But religion is flawed because man puts himself in charge of God's affairs and man is imperfect. If god approves in your actions then you are justified by the highest power and no man can question an authority greater than ours right? The creator made no requests that we worship him in church/temple every week or that we nominate a leader on his behalf or that heaven has a limited amount of places afaik. But you can find justification for this in the holy books - Bible/Koran/Torah. Thats where imo the corruption lies, individual faith can be a purer form of belief. Is it possible for a universe to be created? for me, yes because as we observe everything is created/born. 
And i agree with you when you said if god exists he would be nothing like we imagined. If you accept that he made us in his own image then it doesnt mean we have the same appearance.
And TUNA I didnt know Paw was trying to prove there was a god, he could have given better examples than that one though lol. 

lol actually stephen hawking compared the question "what's before the big bang" to "what's beyond the north pole"
I remember him saying to a question of what happen before the big bang.  "What happen before the big bang, doesn't matter."
yea i think its his attempt to explain to us what is inexplicable or infinite because infinity just is. I dont know about the north pole analogy but beyond the north pole is the south pole so he might b suggesting that space curves in hence wormholes and time travel. Or maybe hes just stating its nothing significant idk.
I can't remember where i read this but i recall scientists trying to discover the theory of everything where all laws are known and the secrets/origins of the universe are revealed - no more unanswered questions. Is there such a thing? Once we do or if we achieve this then we would theoretically know as much as God or be gods, take your pick.
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Posts: 1352 		Post Options Post Options   Quote SIZZLE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Aug 2010 at 7:52pm
no Trendy that was a much different situation. the US and the USSR never wanted a war! that was posturing! the Cuban missle crisis was serious but neither side was radical and wanted to use any nukes!

Iran's intentions with nukes are unclear! Once Iran gets nukes its out of our hands and in there's! Thats a scary thought 4 sure!

If they were to launch a nuke it could start a chain reaction of nuke launching? leaving not even a fan for the sh1t to hit!
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Originally posted by uc SYZYGY uc

Kaos is beginning to rare its ugly head! the *Iran having nukes* issue is without a doubt the most dangerous situation in our history!


There was this thing called the cold war, you may have heard of it......
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Originally posted by uc SYZYGY uc

see i love that post tRiNiTy! now thats the way to discuss a subject! great job! if only athiest scientists could discuss things that good? xD
Smile tnx man 
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Stephen Hawking has been doing nothing but thinking for years! His life story is one of pure mental toughness. if he doesn't inspire you nothing will! BUT he doesn't have the answers! Probability=Odds are or Most likely

Thats the best even he can do! and he's given it more thought then most anyone! he leans towards Intelligent design though? HM

IMO there's more! how could there be more though if man can't see it or find it? maybe it doesn't dwell here? maybe it only visits and doesn't stay? maybe we will all find out soon?

1 thing is 4 sure! were at a very bad time! Kaos is beginning to rare its ugly head! the *Iran having nukes* issue is without a doubt the most dangerous situation in our history! they all haft to get that one right!

If Iran's leadership is serious about wiping Isreal off the map? then that puts the rest of the world in a very troubling possition!

what should be done though? thats may be the most important question in our history? i just hope there smart enough to answer it!
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Posts: 2974 		Post Options Post Options   Quote SP61gTSupra Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Aug 2010 at 7:18pm
Originally posted by TuNA FISh

Originally posted by Heavenly_tRiNiTy

Originally posted by SP61gTSupra

Originally posted by Heavenly_tRiNiTy


Do people think someone just invented the idea of a creator God or is it actually possible that through naturally observed phenomena man came to the conclusion that everything is created and nurtured.
''If God didn't exist, man would have created him'' -Voltaire
nice quote but Voltaire would state that, he was opposed to the old establishment, those powers of the divine and nobility. Its his opinion as a philosopher and i realise he said "IF" but he's kinda suggesting that we need a father figure whether real or make believe. France were the first modern secular nation if i recall correctly. Roots of modern atheism?
Stephen Hawkins suggested that if we recognise that the universe has a beginning then it is possible for the universe to have a creator. The big bang theory ( the beginning of universe) doesn't mean there is no god. The universe is measured by space/time but what happened before time (prior to the big bang) is immaterial because it has no observed/measurable/significant impact. Then again he also said that the universe is ever expanding so it has no beginning nor end which challenges the place of God in the universe.
For me, once religion placed itself in direct opposition of science, there was a shift in power. Religious philosophers were proved profoundly wrong on fundamentals as the orbit of the earth/sun and its position in the universe. They obviously mistrusted or felt threatened by scientific enquiry. So once science proved to be more accurate than religion it questioned many others things such as our origin etc. Religion got it wrong and science is seemed more reliable the faith. But religion is flawed because man puts himself in charge of God's affairs and man is imperfect. If god approves in your actions then you are justified by the highest power and no man can question an authority greater than ours right? The creator made no requests that we worship him in church/temple every week or that we nominate a leader on his behalf or that heaven has a limited amount of places afaik. But you can find justification for this in the holy books - Bible/Koran/Torah. Thats where imo the corruption lies, individual faith can be a purer form of belief. Is it possible for a universe to be created? for me, yes because as we observe everything is created/born. 
And i agree with you when you said if god exists he would be nothing like we imagined. If you accept that he made us in his own image then it doesnt mean we have the same appearance.
And TUNA I didnt know Paw was trying to prove there was a god, he could have given better examples than that one though lol. 

lol actually stephen hawking compared the question "what's before the big bang" to "what's beyond the north pole"
I remember him saying to a question of what happen before the big bang.  "What happen before the big bang, doesn't matter."
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Posts: 2994 		Post Options Post Options   Quote TuNA FISh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Aug 2010 at 10:37am
Originally posted by Heavenly_tRiNiTy

Originally posted by SP61gTSupra

Originally posted by Heavenly_tRiNiTy


Do people think someone just invented the idea of a creator God or is it actually possible that through naturally observed phenomena man came to the conclusion that everything is created and nurtured.
''If God didn't exist, man would have created him'' -Voltaire
nice quote but Voltaire would state that, he was opposed to the old establishment, those powers of the divine and nobility. Its his opinion as a philosopher and i realise he said "IF" but he's kinda suggesting that we need a father figure whether real or make believe. France were the first modern secular nation if i recall correctly. Roots of modern atheism?
Stephen Hawkins suggested that if we recognise that the universe has a beginning then it is possible for the universe to have a creator. The big bang theory ( the beginning of universe) doesn't mean there is no god. The universe is measured by space/time but what happened before time (prior to the big bang) is immaterial because it has no observed/measurable/significant impact. Then again he also said that the universe is ever expanding so it has no beginning nor end which challenges the place of God in the universe.
For me, once religion placed itself in direct opposition of science, there was a shift in power. Religious philosophers were proved profoundly wrong on fundamentals as the orbit of the earth/sun and its position in the universe. They obviously mistrusted or felt threatened by scientific enquiry. So once science proved to be more accurate than religion it questioned many others things such as our origin etc. Religion got it wrong and science is seemed more reliable the faith. But religion is flawed because man puts himself in charge of God's affairs and man is imperfect. If god approves in your actions then you are justified by the highest power and no man can question an authority greater than ours right? The creator made no requests that we worship him in church/temple every week or that we nominate a leader on his behalf or that heaven has a limited amount of places afaik. But you can find justification for this in the holy books - Bible/Koran/Torah. Thats where imo the corruption lies, individual faith can be a purer form of belief. Is it possible for a universe to be created? for me, yes because as we observe everything is created/born. 
And i agree with you when you said if god exists he would be nothing like we imagined. If you accept that he made us in his own image then it doesnt mean we have the same appearance.
And TUNA I didnt know Paw was trying to prove there was a god, he could have given better examples than that one though lol. 

lol actually stephen hawking compared the question "what's before the big bang" to "what's beyond the north pole"
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Posts: 1352 		Post Options Post Options   Quote SIZZLE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Aug 2010 at 8:24am
see i love that post tRiNiTy! now thats the way to discuss a subject! great job! if only athiest scientists could discuss things that good? xD
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Originally posted by uc SYZYGY uc

i just farted!
lol are you saying that if farting didn't exist man would have created it?? that s a whole new universe of hot gases expanding through space governed by time forming galaxies and solar systems. I'm presuming u plan to create solid masses at some point? Second thoughts, I prefer this universe.
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Originally posted by SP61gTSupra

Originally posted by Heavenly_tRiNiTy


Do people think someone just invented the idea of a creator God or is it actually possible that through naturally observed phenomena man came to the conclusion that everything is created and nurtured.
''If God didn't exist, man would have created him'' -Voltaire
nice quote but Voltaire would state that, he was opposed to the old establishment, those powers of the divine and nobility. Its his opinion as a philosopher and i realise he said "IF" but he's kinda suggesting that we need a father figure whether real or make believe. France were the first modern secular nation if i recall correctly. Roots of modern atheism?
Stephen Hawkins suggested that if we recognise that the universe has a beginning then it is possible for the universe to have a creator. The big bang theory ( the beginning of universe) doesn't mean there is no god. The universe is measured by space/time but what happened before time (prior to the big bang) is immaterial because it has no observed/measurable/significant impact. Then again he also said that the universe is ever expanding so it has no beginning nor end which challenges the place of God in the universe.
For me, once religion placed itself in direct opposition of science, there was a shift in power. Religious philosophers were proved profoundly wrong on fundamentals as the orbit of the earth/sun and its position in the universe. They obviously mistrusted or felt threatened by scientific enquiry. So once science proved to be more accurate than religion it questioned many others things such as our origin etc. Religion got it wrong and science is seemed more reliable the faith. But religion is flawed because man puts himself in charge of God's affairs and man is imperfect. If god approves in your actions then you are justified by the highest power and no man can question an authority greater than ours right? The creator made no requests that we worship him in church/temple every week or that we nominate a leader on his behalf or that heaven has a limited amount of places afaik. But you can find justification for this in the holy books - Bible/Koran/Torah. Thats where imo the corruption lies, individual faith can be a purer form of belief. Is it possible for a universe to be created? for me, yes because as we observe everything is created/born. 
And i agree with you when you said if god exists he would be nothing like we imagined. If you accept that he made us in his own image then it doesnt mean we have the same appearance.
And TUNA I didnt know Paw was trying to prove there was a god, he could have given better examples than that one though lol. 
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i just farted!
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Posts: 2974 		Post Options Post Options   Quote SP61gTSupra Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Aug 2010 at 7:17am
Originally posted by Heavenly_tRiNiTy


Do people think someone just invented the idea of a creator God or is it actually possible that through naturally observed phenomena man came to the conclusion that everything is created and nurtured.
''If God didn't exist, man would have created him'' -Voltaire
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Posts: 2340 		Post Options Post Options   Quote TX2k7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Aug 2010 at 5:17am
here... watch and discuss this:

LOL o.O
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Posts: 2994 		Post Options Post Options   Quote TuNA FISh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2010 at 7:16pm
actually this thread was made by pawweezy to prove that God is real.. me and a few others called it retarded..
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Originally posted by TuNA FISh

actually, the discussion was never really about science vs god.. we were just defending science since everyone else except a few are retarded. all i remember seeing was wiki post after wiki post and eventually i lost interest
Tuna the essence of this thread was exactly to ridicule the religious beliefs of some "christians". Its an easy kill cos "watch and discuss" people communicating through God without actually making any coherent sense or meaningful language structure is imo their sub-conscientious attempt to reconstruct events in the old testament - for you it's BS. Once you apply the willingness of some religious followers to believe anything without proof (e.g. the existence of a God no one has ever seen) then it becomes a generalisation about religion without scientific foundation. Hence Science vs God. Which is more real a God created from nothing or a universe that appears out of nowhere? Glass half full or half empty?
Science tells us a lot, religion give us a lot of purpose. Do people think someone just invented the idea of a creator God or is it actually possible that through naturally observed phenomena man came to the conclusion that everything is created and nurtured. So this must be a universal occurrence. And if this 'observation' sounds a little like the natural sciences then why not? Genes, chromosomes, DNA have a genetic programme, to be passed on from one generation to another and ensure that species survive. Why is it SO important that we do procreate and survive?? After all we're just space dust but what sparked intelligence to become complete competing and evolving lifeforms?
At least as many scientists believe in some form of creator so scientists are not atheists by definition, they recognise that chaos cannot be so purposeful. In other words the odds are in favour of a creator cos the chances of everything being just right for intelligent life to evolve on earth too incredible. I do know that Stephen Hawking said it is possible that due to the vastness of the universe that an earth like planet with the same conditions to sustain life proly exists but  the odds of finding it are remote. For me this is believable it still does not contradict the creator theory, ppls views are in opposition - thats the sticking point! Open minds are more receptive to the possibilities.
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Posts: 2994 		Post Options Post Options   Quote TuNA FISh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 7:28pm
Originally posted by uc SYZYGY uc

hey i agree? over priced colledge!

it is sooo over-priced.. i read that full-time college professors make 6 digits every year and that their job is very very relaxed.. they had a college professor on NPR talking about how they don't even really prepare that much for class because they know it all already.
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Posts: 2994 		Post Options Post Options   Quote TuNA FISh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 7:20pm
actually, the discussion was never really about science vs god.. we were just defending science since everyone else except a few are retarded. all i remember seeing was wiki post after wiki post and eventually i lost interest
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Posts: 2101 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Heavenly_tRiNiTy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 6:51pm
I personally have nothing against anyone who doesn't bear me/family malice. Gay/straighy/black/white/ etc - live and let live but its true. thats what a lot of ppl miss about religion. They see or hear one/two unsavoury things then take that as the norm. 
Having read some of the posts on here since i left im still seeing the same stuff - Scientists saying "show me proof". Ive said this b4 and i'll state it again more clearly. Everyone has an idea of the world we live in and they act based on their interpretation of this belief (and whatever code/creed they value). We arguably all see the same thing but interpret them differently. Science vs God? You might as well argue if a glass filled half way with milk is 50% full or 50% empty - were still describing the same thing. Atheism is a belief system - science is its main justification. Scientists will change their view of occurrences, suggesting different theories. You get differing interpretations of religious events and people cry hypocrisy - theres only one truth. 
Cos I'm Wonderman...I'll take that knife and shove it up your a$$!
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Deadaim View Drop Down
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Joined: 21 Jan 2009
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Posts: 1791 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Deadaim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 3:16pm
wbc isnt about religion, they are just backward ass hicks. they are huge homophobes and if u read about them supposedly some of the uncles in the family are gay (according to the people of westboro). people like them should be shot on sight
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Joined: 05 Feb 2009
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Posts: 1447 		Post Options Post Options   Quote SilverJ-17 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 3:08pm
I only said again because I found something new to add to this, though maybe I should of brought WBC in another thread, since a few comments on there (possibly from Christians) said they don't deserve to be called Christians or called them wolves in sheep's clothing.
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